Episode 3 : OLD (Haunted?) Louisville - INTERVIEW WITH AUTHOR David Domine

Participant #1:
Music. New Year's Eve. It is New Years. New Year's Eve. 2020. We've been waiting for this. It's time to say goodbye. Go on your merry way 2020. You've brought so many joys to so many people. I feel like tonight I was like, let's get back into Kentucky, see what's going on around our state. Okay. Where are we going? We're going to old Louisville. Yeah, it's not the new Louisville. Okay. So. Yeah. This is old Louisville witches tree. Okay. When you say witches tree, what are we like I mean, is it like, legit? We got somebody coming on. Yeah, I'll be calling him here soon. His name is David. I was told that he was one of the first people to write about this particular witches tree. Okay, so we got a ground zero guy. We kind of got a ground zero guy. He might not be ground zero. Maybe ground one. Ground one? Like he's like a little on the sidelines. I was reading before you got here, we started this, I read a little bit, kind of like touching up on our witches tree in Alexandria, Kentucky. And there's a lot of urban legends about that one. Really? I haven't took the time. One thing I really want to know, what makes a witches tree? All I kept thinking is it that they are hanging it. They were killed. They were hung in that tree. And they fix the shirts on it. Or do they do rituals around the tree? So it makes the third tree. I don't know what makes the stamp that says which is tree. That way it's got the same thing going on. Yeah, same thing. They were hung in it. There are three Humps on Rifle Range Road right before, and they said that's the grave sites. I remember them. I remember hearing about that. Yeah. And then all the bad luck that came about when they were trying to cut the tree down. Yeah. My story is a bad case of telephone because you hear it from one guy that heard it from another guy. I heard it from his cousin. Right. And his cousin probably heard it from his cousins on his other side of his family. Well, my other one was where a guy was trying to cut it down, was using a chainsaw. The chainsaw gets stuck. He's trying to pull it out, and as he like, it gets free. I guess he had his finger right on the trigger. He came out and it kicked back on him and hit him in the face or something like that and killed him. Wow, that sucks.

Participant #1:
Okay. I don't know the one around here. I don't know if there's any stories like that about it, but this the old Louisville tree. Okay, so it's got a little bit of a body count. Yeah. Good. It has, like, at least one well, the thing of it is that it's just the story behind it. Lane, I don't want to get too much into it until we get the guy on, but it just looks weird. Like, man, it's the form tree and the way that it looks, you're just like when you think of a witches tree. Yeah, I did see the pictures of it, the ones you showed me, the gnarled, burls and craziness going on. It is crazy looking. I mean, I have other words that are coming to mind when I think of us looking at it, but it's wild, that's for sure. I'm interested. Before we go into that though, there's one thing we got to do. Everybody who subscribed to this brand new podcast, thank you so much. If you're brand new listening to us, follow along. Maybe something will pique your interest in and we're glad to have you. For everybody who downloaded it and listened to the last couple of episodes, truly appreciate it and tell your friends and let's get everybody involved. And as always, if you have a story of your own, get in contact with us. Encounters@kyxfiles.com. Doesn't matter how crazy the story is, it doesn't matter what it's about, just hit us and we'll get back to you as soon as we can and hopefully get to hear your story. Okay, I guess we're going to give him a call. His name is David.

Participant #1:
Hello? Hello? Yeah, this is David. We're actually starting the recording right now. Ann that's right. Yeah. Okay. Well, David, as we're getting into this, I just kind of want to give the kind of a backstory to who you are. I was told that you were one of the first people to write about this wishes tree. Is this something that you normally talk about, you write about and stuff, or is this just a hobby? Well, yes and no. I'm the first person to actually write about the witcher street. And how I got involved in all this is I lived in a lovable for many years. I moved out of the neighborhood a couple of years ago but still live very near the neighborhood. But old louvre is one of the largest historic preservation districts in the United States. There's 45 square blocks of old houses, roughly 1400 old homes and mansions, and over the years, it's acquired reputation for being America's most haunted neighborhood. And I began writing about the neighborhood in 2005. That's when my first book came out. I used to live in a house on third street on what is known as the old millionaire's row. It was a three story house built in 1895 that was supposedly haunted. That's what the previous owner had called me. It came with a ghost named Lucy, and I love ghost stories. I don't know if I believe a ghost. I've never seen one. So I didn't really take it too seriously. And I moved into the house and all these strange things she told me about started to happen. I started footsteps in the middle of the night. Oh, really? My pet started acting crazy, things would break. There was this one wall. She told me not to hang pictures on the wall because pictures would always fall off that wall. She said it was the poltergeist would knock them down. And showing that for the eight years we were in that house, we could never keep a picture on that wall. I never did see a ghost in the time I was in the house. But all these weird things happened, and that's what made me start to see the neighborhood in a different light. I started talking to people and they started sharing their stories about the old homes and matches they lived in, the family legends that have been passed down. So I started writing down these stories as my way of kind of promoting the neighborhood. And since then, I've had twelve books published. Wow. Not all of them are about the neighborhood. Not all of them are about the ghosts in the neighborhood. But the twelve books I've written about, the most popular are the three or four sets of ghost stories, mostly true ghost stories from the neighborhood. Wow. And so I just really love this neighborhood. And I find that folklore, legends, ghost stories, it's a great way to educate about more than just the paranormal. I always tell people, you don't have to believe in ghost to enjoy the ghost story. People love ghost stories. And there's more than just paranormal to ghost stories. People like to be thrilled, but there's history and there's real life characters, there's local flavor. And so one of my recent books, that's when I wrote about the witches tree. And the witches tree is a narrowed and twisted tree that sits at the corner of Six Land Park in old Blue. And according to legend, it's a corner where back in the day, a covenant witches used to meet. Okay. Supposedly back then, there was a tall maple tree that stood there, and it was a beautifully tall, majestic, perfectly straight tree. And every night, this covenant of witches would meet under its branches. And there they'd cast their spells and they grew their potions. And they do the things that riches do. They went on that way for many, many years. But 1889, things are kind of interrupted because that year the city announced it plans to chop down the beautiful tree because they wanted to use it for the upcoming Mayday celebrations. They wanted it for May poll. If you know anything about Mayday, may 1, we don't celebrate in the United States like we used to 100, 200 years ago. May 1 was like the welcome to spring. It was the banishment of the cold winter months, and they were celebrating the warm spring and summer months ahead. The centerpiece of any maid activities. Yeah, they've been made pole. They find a tall, beautiful tree, they sell it, they strip it of its bark. It's a student with garlands and reefs and greenery they directed someplace and from the top of Danglers of Hawthorne and from that green reef they would dangle colorful ribbons and usually children are grab the end of these ribbons, they do these intricate dances, they need these elaborate patterns and happy, festive, joyous occasions. But anything about witches, at least the stereotypical kind, they're not big unhappy, festive, joyous occasions and they don't have children so they don't like this plan for their tree. They warned the city not to chop the tree down from them and take it away from them. But they must not have taken witches seriously in global back then because someone came and they chopped the tree down. Now they came crashing to the ground. The witches went shrinking off to the west end where back in the day they were still forced in that part of town the witches found a forest with a new maple tree where they could hide out and continue their rituals. But before they left the head which turned around as you cursed to see and her final words were aware 11th months and no one really understood what the warning was and no one took it seriously. And they first came, they danced around the Maypole afterwards they chopped it up into logs and they burnt the logs in the big witch and type bonfire as was custom. And people they promptly forgot about the witches, they promptly forgot about the warning and they thought that was that. But exactly eleven months later they were reminded of the curse. March 27, 1890, the day the witch's curse came to fruition. And it came in the form of a massive tornado that came barreling out of the witch's forest to the west. And it was in the evening people who saw this tornado kind of emerged from the witch's forest and come barreling towards downtown. Google said it was huge. Eyewitnesses said it looked more like a small hurricane rather than a cyclone with a funnel cloud. It was massive. And they said you could see a face in the clouds of this truning tornado and they called it the storm demon. And the storm demon was the witch's revenge for stealing their tree. And a lot of this is legend because legends inherently are untrue but a lot of times things get rise to a legend. The tornado March from the 7th 90s is a fact and it's a fact that newspapers across the country, including the New York Times, they wrote about the storm demon, that people had seen the space in the cloud. So there's a lot of documentation. Parts of this legend wasn't that that was just one tornado of many that happened on that same day, wasn't it all over a certain region of the United States? Yeah, this was the one that hit Louisville and it was one of the two deadliest in the city's history. And the tornado barreled into town and just destroyed most of what was downtown rubber back then what was the city corps. And for weeks afterwards, newspapers across the country, they followed reports on what was happening. They reported daily on the quote, great heart of Louisville and they were worried the city weren't survived. They thought this might ruin the city. But the city pulled together. But they said this tornado, some people have ranked it even today in the top 2025 deadliest tornadoes in American history. And it only was in the city for four minutes. But in those four minutes, the whole downtown commercial corridor was destroyed. Big bourbon warehouses, tobacco warehouses were flattened, the train station was destroyed, hospitals, churches, schools, temples and hundreds of homes and mansions were blown to bits. And in the end, upwards of 120 people were killed. And they said of those people killed, the good number belonged to something known as the Main Day Celebration Committee. Committee that turned down the tree, installed it from the witches. So it looks like the witches got their revenge in the end. And the thing is, after the tornado rebootsabook in downtown horrible, it started kind of rolling east, rolling south out of the city and it eventually came into what is old today, which is immediately south of the city. And as it came to the corner where the witch's tree had stood, they said a bolt of lightning shot up from the tornado was like it was hurled by the hand of the storm demon. This bolt of lightning hit the stump of the naval tree that used to be there, but there was this huge explosion and in a shower of sparks and flame and smoke, the tree that is there today sprang up from the earth to replace the tree that was stolen from the witches. And if you see the tree, you see it's not perfect and straight like it used to. It's gnarled and twisted, it's covered in burles and warding bark. Half of the branches overhead are dead and kind of spooky and ominous looking. And people say spooky and ominous is always good for witches. So not surprised the witches have returned to that corner. And many nights you'll find witches there brewing their potions and casting their spells and doing the things that witches do. And over the years it's become something of a tourist attraction. People go to their corner and they leave things on the tree to kind of make amends to the witches to realize they're not going to steal from them anymore. They leave horseshoes a lot of times they say if you are going out to bed on the ponies at Churchill Downs, you leave the horseshoe. The riches will help you get on the ponies. So you see a lot of horse related things like beads and all kinds of trinkets, angels, candles. There's been some documentation that voodoo people used to meet there. So there's a lot of voodoo things. You see which bottles and Gregory bags. Gregory bottles. Lots of beads. Like New Orleans. Mardi Gras. Bead people. You roll up prayers, they've written a parchment or on paper and wedge it in the bars. Old coins, bells, dolls, all kinds of things that people eat. Everything. And of course people steal things from the tree as well. It's not a good idea to steal from the witches though, because they have a Facebook page and people steal from the witches. The witches on Facebook will put curses on them. You can actually go to the page and see some of the curses that have been levied over the years. They're equal opportunity, which is though, they'll also give good luck charms, blessings to people. They've kind of moved more neutral. Yeah, okay, got it. What about like right now, the more recent is it still kind of anonymous centerpiece to that area? Or is it do people look more like a tourist attraction or is it an actual you know what I mean? What is that? It is a big tourist attraction. People come to lead things and take pictures. But new age witches, they meet there on a regular basis. Night for the summer solstice, the fall equinox. I've seen groups there. A couple of summers ago, I was driving home. It was the night of the summer solstice and it looked like a group of maybe ten or twelve people. They were standing around the tree. They were holding hands in a ring and they were all wearing like white kind of drew it down. They had big droopy hoods. You couldn't see their faces. You couldn't tell if they were men or women, but they were kind of chanting and swaying. They were doing something around the tree. And I give tours at the neighborhood and we usually stop after. We're just trying to tell them the story and show them the things that people leave on the tree. And we've come across people there during the day lighting candles and doing ceremonies. Wow. A lot of the local witches or the wicked pagan community, they do use the tree. I actually know three, actually one just passed a month ago, sadly. But I know three local witches that know a lot about the tree and they use it for their that's very interesting. It's neat because getting online and researching the subject, I couldn't find a whole lot. I mean, the Atypical story, that kind of summarizes to a lesser extent what you just told us, but we didn't get as many details like we're getting from you, which is awesome. It's great. The old thing that I always loved was you don't really know a place until you know what she dreams of. And I always look at that, like the folklore around the place and hearing about the ghost stories and all that and the witches tree and fascinating. But a lot of this is oral tradition. People tell the stories and depending who tells the story, they have things they take things away. They embellish things. So one of the things I did and I tried to research as much as I could and talk to people and with those different sources, that's how I was able to kind of cobble together that version of the story, which is, I think, the most accurate. Like I said, it's a legend. So inherently, a lot of sins in the legend, they're untrue. But like I said, there's always something in a legend that gives rise to it. And in this case, it would be the fact that there was that tornado, March 2790. And then the tree itself is actually an osage orange tree. It just has a strange aspect. It's just so spooky looking. That's a beautiful tree. You look at the tree and you know there's a story there. And then if you lived in an apartment like I did for years, I'd walk my dogs past the tree and I'd see candles on the tree and people leaving, like chicken bone ornaments and crucifixes and stuff. Why were they doing that? There has to be some reason. So that's when I started talking to people and snooping around and I dug up as much information as I think I could. Well, that's awesome. It's nice to be able to speak to someone who has so much insight about this. One thing I was really frustrated is we've been putting together this podcast and we've got everything lined up from cryptozoos to ghost stories to UFO sightings, things like that. Most of it is talking to an actual person and hearing their experience and their story. And Tyler, he brought it to me. He's like, man, I got this witches tree thing. Look at this thing and shows me a picture. And I'm like, that's crazy looking. But then we researched it. There's not that much to find on the Internet. But you said you should read just in the last five or six years and my last two books, that's when I wrote about it. And that was the first time it was actually put in print. So it's just in the recent years that people are finding out about it. That's why there's not a lot of information out there about it. I see. Okay. Maybe if you wouldn't mind, you could send us over how we can get a hold of your book and stuff like that. When we put this podcast up, we'll actually put your links and stuff like that information on your books and everything that you're doing. That'd be great because I know there's going to be more people, not just us out there wanting to know more. And it would be nice to be able to point them towards you, at least to learn this incredible story. But it's loaded with ghost stories. Is there anything else that jumps out, maybe up there with the old witches tree? There's tons. I've talked to people or investigated Douglas history on at least like 100 different places that are supposedly haunted in the neighborhood. But in my books, I've probably written down 25 or 30 of the stories. So one of them is the house where I used to live called the Wigmar House on Third Street. There's a church at the corner, third and Orange. We have haunted by someone they called the lady of the stairs. It's a beautiful church. And they see this female apparition pacing across the porch very often in the evening on cold nights. They say the ghost of a young woman who was supposed to meet her fiance there one night. They were supposed to elope. Her parents didn't approve of him, but she waited all night. He was stationed at nearby Camp Zachary Taylor. This was in 1918, 1919, and he never showed up that night. She waited all night waiting for him. She finally gave up, went home, killed to the bone. And it turns out he hadn't shown up because it was the second wave of Spanish flu, and he was struck down with the Spanish flu. She got it as well. They both died within days of each other. They went to the graves, never finding out what happened to the other. So they think her ghost haunts the stairs because she's still waiting for him. Well, the heart of the neighborhood is a place called St. James Court. Central park, the main residential enclave. There's a house museum called the convent called the house. Beautiful romance. Limestone national from the 1890s got five or six ghosts that haunt the place. There's a famous pink palace. It's haunted by a helpful ghost called Avery. There's a young boy that shows up in the winter. They call him Iceberg. He supposedly was a ghostly regga. Muffler came from days when he died in a fire in one of the big buildings. There's an apartment building on the court. Well, there's a house on fourth street that's actually the topic of my 13th book, which will be out next year.

Participant #1:
If you Google it, it got a lot of national coverage. There was a gristling murder uncovered in 2010. It was the evening of June 17, 2010. That night at 930, the police got a call. One of the guys living there was barricade, and the bedroom on the second floor was the owner. His name is Jeffrey Munt. And he called the police, telling them his boyfriend was outside in the hallway trying to break through the wind door to come inside and murder him. So the police responded. The king and the rest of the disabled. His name was Joey Banners. And in the process of questioning the truth, they started hearing grumbling about somebody knowing something or a body was buried. And they didn't really take it seriously until they went down to the basement. They started digging and 4ft below the surface, because it was a dirt floor, they found the body of Jamie Carroll and a blue rubber main container. I think I heard something about that. Yes. It was huge. And they both blamed each other. It was three years before they went on trial. I sat in on both of those trials. So the trial itself is fascinating, but what's really interesting is the house they lived in kind of has a really sinister past. It was a sanatorium at one time. A guy named Doctor Van Deen was eventually brought up on ethics charges and rumors to have done strange things. And there are a lot of patients died under circumstances. The woman who sold the house to Jeffrey Munt was brutally attacked one night by one of her tenants. And she didn't die right then and there. And they took her to a hospital to recover, but she never recovered. Almost later, she was dead. Wow. There was a room in the basement, actually, where the guy was buried, supposedly had been used for satanic rituals at one time. And there was, like, a Catholic called down there. The guy that killed was a drag queen by the name of Jamie Carroll. That was his real name. But when he wasn't Jamie Carroll, he was known as Ronnika Reid, the Magic Queen. Wow. And supposedly the room had been an SM club at one time. Just all these weird, bizarre things. And so that's the topic of my next book. Last I heard, the title is going to be a Dark Room in Glitterball City. And so it's supposed to be out by Falling. Awesome, man. I'm telling you what, man, I hope we're not boring you, but I am thoroughly enjoying hearing all this and hearing your story and the story of old, which is there's so many layers there. There's so much there. And what happens is so many people, they don't appreciate what they have in their own backyard. People in Kentucky don't even know about a lot of people in Louisville don't even know about this neighborhood downtown. That's one of the largest historic preservation districts in the country. That's one of the things when I write my stories and do my tours, I just like letting people know what an interesting neighborhood this is. There's just so many fascinating things about Google. I always tell people, if you like old houses, it's a beautiful place. There's just hundreds and hundreds of all Victorian mansion. Next time in your town, just let me know and I'll show you around, show you some of these places up close in person. Definitely do that. Absolutely. I think it's kind of sad in America, but finding little places like that where they're trying to protect those old buildings. I actually said this to Tyler here. It was probably a couple of months ago. It's kind of sad that in America, we tear down our old buildings and we do a lot of history. For every one beautiful old building you see, there's probably ten more that have been lost to history. Look at pictures of any, like where you live. Look at pictures of what it looked like a hundred years ago downtown. Yeah, just totally different. American cities, towns, very few of them have their character. We have beautiful public buildings and churches. Some remain, but the American way, especially because of urban renewal in the was a program designed to help cities. But in a lot of places it resulted in tearing down everything old and trying to put up new things. And then the interstate system cut through a lot of towns, cities and destroyed neighborhoods. That happened in old rules. The fact that there are so many old houses that survive is due to there is a lot of preservation minded people who really fought to save the neighborhood. They not banded together and fought to save the neighborhood would have been like a lot of places across the United States. We just tore things down left and right. They swallowed up by time. It's depressing, honestly. Yeah. Up here we have a few places right before we called, you may tell us. We're actually talking about we actually had up until a couple of years ago, our own witch is tree near Alexandria, Kentucky, which had its own history and story. I've heard about that one, actually. Yeah, I've heard about that one. I haven't seen it, but that's kind of on my bucket list of creepy places the state to see. Unfortunately, a few years back they finally succeeded in cutting it down after years of trying. Yeah, no tornadoes yet though. The location is people still go to the location though, don't they? Yeah, I believe they do. But it's probably not someone telling me they went they did an investigation there or something and the tree wasn't there. But they still granted me a lot of weird things that much. Oh, yeah, that is a common thing here. The whole story behind it too is just odd because when I was a kid, I've heard stories about it all over. Like there are these three humps going to it and they always say that's the grave sites of the witches that they hung there. And then you always keep telling yourself, is this true? But if you get back there, the way that they cut the road, this tree only had enough dirt for itself. So it made you think about it. There has to be something around it because why would they literally just make a turnabout and literally leave one tree in the middle of the road? The other thing, the humps in the road, the land on both sides of that street, it's like gradual slope and then flat. There's no real reason for these three humps there. Yeah, I always found that kind of interesting too. That's amazing how many places seem to sprout up a witch tree. Something to that, maybe. I've always wondered what does make a witch tree? I've always wondered like you were saying that they always just. Do their magic. And is it just a place of worship? It's their temple. Is that what you would consider that's what it was. It was like it was like their sacred tree fell sick where they could do their rituals. But I've heard of others just because it's a spooky looking tree, they call it riches tree. Yeah. And I heard different variations, like the one you're talking about with witches were buried. That has something to do with it. A lot of times I think it's flipping tree. Yeah, I can definitely think of a couple of them like that. Up here we have the witches tree. We have a couple of places. There's an old bobby mackey's down there that's a big one. Oh, yeah. No one knows about that. Yeah. And then lately, we've been kind of delving into a couple of other local legends and things like that. It's really wild. I actually know of a place. It was a few years ago, it was told to me it's actually an old log cabin. And right now, there's a huge arcadia is what it's called, a huge suburb that just got put in. And behind it, in between it and the Lake River, is an old log cabin. And from what I've been told over the years, this old log cabin was the home of a witch. They say that because of everything and the developments keep getting closer to the cabin. They said that once they finally tear down the cabin, that's when she'll have her revenge. And I'm like, well, they already cut down a tree. Maybe there's something there. Maybe we'll see. I don't know. Hopefully they leave the cabin. I think it wouldn't hurt nobody to not press it. Yeah, well, this kind of just dawned on me a little bit. All these others, like you said, you've written many books about the local lore around there, especially ghost stories. Do you think, like, a lot of these paranormal and ghosts going on in that area? You think it might be aftermath of what from the tree? It seems like a far fetched thing, but you see, such a big thing happened back then kind of tripled to it. Like it just made that land somewhat of a cursed land. Like, every time you come here, there's a chance that if you cross the switches, maybe I don't know. When the tornado happened, it was kind of as the neighborhood was being developed. Okay. So that could tie again. But what some of my paranormal friends have told me they think is the reason why the neighborhood is so haunted and why there's so many stories and legends is because Louisville, the houses for Americans, by American fans that are old, average, like 130 years old. So we've seen a lot of history. Lots of generations have lived and loved and died behind these fortresses like walls. But the thing is, unlike a lot of Victorian neighborhoods, where the houses are built up wood in Louisville. Most of them are built of locally quarried limestone and locally made brick. So they got really thick walls and solid foundation. Sometimes the basement foundations are 8ft thick and the brick wall is really thick. And so some of my paranormal friends have told me they think we're dealing with residual hauntings. These houses, they're like energy traps. They've retained memories of things that have happened in the past. Things that happen kind of imprinted themselves. And given the right circumstances, it's like a recording. It plays itself back over and over again. It was over 100 some people died in that tornado, didn't they? Yeah. That's a lot of ghosts right there at once. I'm not sure the science behind ghosts, but it seems like if you needed a bunch of ghosts quickly and a big nasty tornado like that would probably do the job. Yeah, that could be. Yeah. It's fascinating though. Absolutely. So you said you got a new book you're working on right now. Well, the one I told you about, that's my next book. And the books I'm working on right now are literary fiction. So nothing paranormal about that. I'm in Mexico City right now. I came here to do some research to the current book I'm working on. So how would somebody find all your work if they were wanting to look? Amazon.com has all twelve of my books, and when I started writing, I was a food writer. When I was living in this fully haunted house, I was working on cookbooks. A lot of people like food, so I include descriptions of dinner parties and stuff. And some of my books. People, most people wanted me to do that, but I do history and architecture. I photograph with memoirs and sketches. Interior design, I've got a different kind of palette. But yeah, all twelve of my current books are on Amazon.com. The two I recommend people get on my very last two. Book number twelve is called Fabulousa. That was what they called the house I lived in, the Casa Fabulosa, the Fabulous house in Spanish because I really colorful facade. And that's a memoir about that first year I lived in the house. That's when I found out about the witches tree, met gypsies in the neighborhood and found out about this fascinating gypsy pass. And all they do know we had and started meeting these people and they told me their stories. And it's when the strange things were going on in my house. It all happened when I discovered it was the real life characters in the neighborhood that was the most interesting. It's kind of humorous. There's some spooky stuff as well. And then book number eleven, the one before, was called True Ghost Stories and Erie Legends of America's Most Haunted Neighborhood. And that is basically I took my three previous ghost story collections and I edited and updated them all, put them in one book. And so if you get that one book that pretty much covers the three previous books I did ten years before. Okay. But yeah, if you like the paranormal stuff that's, let's say true ghost stories and legends from Americanmost haunted neighborhoods in the voodoo days at la casa, probably both of those are available on audible.com as well. Okay, great. I'm a big fan of the audiobooks. I have kind of an issue. I am too. Not for every book I actually read I listen to three or four on. I had a problem where I used to have thousands of books and unfortunate circumstances. I lost almost all of them, but I started to get on the audible and basically buy the ones that I had that I would really love and start listening to them over and over again. That was a couple of hundred audiobooks ago and now I'm to the point now where I cannot have them all installed on a single device anymore. Yeah, I'm the same way and it's frustrating, but I'm very interested. I'm going to go ahead and probably pick up this book, the voodoo day and check it out. Great reviews on it. Yeah, so far so good. It's a good overview of the neighborhood. Like I said, I found out, which is true. Actually, I'm a little ashamed of myself because I was just looking because we started this podcast just to we love work for Kentucky boys through and through, raised. We've been here all our lives and we're like, man, there's so much stuff going on in Kentucky, but no one really talks about it a lot. I just was looking around and a lot of people kept pointing to the witches tree, but I was like, man, now I feel like I should have digged a little deeper. Old Louisville seemed like it actually has a big presence center with a lot of history plus paranormal and just all that stuff. So I'm like a little ashamed myself. Yeah, I call Louisville my home from Kentucky. Originally I'm from Wisconsin, but sometimes you need an outsider to kind of see the cool things and shoot someone else's horn because Kentucky people, they're a little more reserved. They don't appreciate that. No backyard, they don't want to brag and stuff. And I've been planning on staying in Kentucky. I didn't want to come to Kentucky to graduate school and I was going to do my year until we get out of town. I was 25 years, here I am. And it was an escape that really impressed me. There's so many unique things about Kentucky, the bourbon culture, tobacco, horse racing, very distinctive history and culture, that's one of the reasons I stayed in old school is the neighborhood that I really loved and that's the reason I stayed in the city. Oh, absolutely. You're right about the reservedness about them too. Something I noticed years ago was when talking to anybody, any kind of crazy or paranormal story, when you're in this state, and someone comes up to you and they're like, you won't believe what happened to me. For me, it's almost like I have to take a second and be like, well, around here, normally no one would come up to you with that kind of like, outwardness about it. Usually people don't want to talk about it. They don't want people to think they're crazy or they're making it up. That's the big fear. Like, people think I'm making things up or whatever. So it always kind of gave me a little credence when hearing someone's one story about something unexplainable, which is why I wanted to do this. I wanted to talk to Morgan, Kentucky, and try to get them to come out of their shit a little bit. Well, there's a lot of stories out there. You just got to get people to talk. Yeah, definitely. A lot of people get in touch with me and tell me stories, and there's some cuckoo people out there. You have to weed through those people or the people that are a little too eager to believe. And so for my sources, the stories that I write, it's the people that just like you were saying, you believe them when they tell their story. Why would they make up something? Right. They have nothing to gain by it. A lot of times people don't want to be ridiculed for being yeah, exactly. People thinking they're crazy and stuff. And these people have told me, I believe that whether or not they actually saw a ghost or they thought they saw a ghost, I don't know, but something happened and it affected them. And that's what I think is so fascinating. Like I said, I don't know if I believe in ghosts myself or not, but I believe in the paranormal. I believe in things outside of the normal. I believe things, experience things. And we may not know what those reasons are, what they actually experience, but that's why I think it's so fascinating. That's why I love writing these stories. Absolutely. This world is so old and powerful and rich in history beyond a regular human beings, even lifespan. There's so much, I think, out there that's beyond our own philosophies. And I really think that as we go forward, maybe we can approach the forward with more open mind. And when one of these good people says, hey, I've seen something, maybe we can take a second and listen to them. And I really think it's a great approach. Like you said, you don't know if you believe it yourself, but the person did, and that was enough. And I think that's awesome. That is really great. I think if we've kept you too long, I'm sorry, but we really appreciate you talking to us. No, enjoy the time and keep me posted. Let me know. Absolutely. Share this, and I'll try to spread the word and let people know. I will put everything that you've ever done or thinking about doing, I will put on this podcast and put it out there and advertise as much as possible. I'll point as many people your way as I can. All right. We're brand new, but we're seeming to pick up some steam pretty quickly. Good. I think it's good luck, and I look forward to hearing a lot of different stories on the podcast. Yeah, man, there's going to be a lot out there, a lot of stuff coming. We've got more stuff we're working on and researching, and we've already got a couple that are done and ready to go. We appreciate it, man. Yeah. You said if you're working on a book right now, that's why you're in. You said New Mexico. If you ever want to come, I'll try to stay in touch with you, but if you ever want to come back on the show again, we'll discuss your book. I love the energy that you give off, man. I can tell that you enjoy what you write about and you're genuine about it, and I like that. That's the type of people that I'm glad that you're out there, you're spreading some words, and you're doing some good of this history. So thanks for being on the plate. Yeah, my pleasure. And Happy New Year to both of you. Yeah, Happy New Year, man. All right, let's keep in touch in 2021. Yeah, absolutely. Later. All right. Like I said, if you ever Louisville, hit me up and I'll show you around. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. All right, sounds good. Take care. Take care. I mean, there we go. That's awesome. I'm still like I said, I am ashamed of myself because, dude, that's freaking old Louisville, man. You know, it's a hopping place. Something I feel a little ashamed about. Yeah. David, he blew my mind here's why. All I knew was there's a guy who wrote about the witches tree. I didn't know what he wrote. I thought maybe it was, like, a newspaper article, maybe a blog. I didn't know what it was. And then this full blown author, writer, professional writer, basically a historian for old Louisville oh, yeah. Comes onto the podcast and starts talking to me, and all of a sudden, I'm over here scrambling, like, whoa, I'm looking up stuff. I'm like, oh, my God. I do not want to waste this guy's time because this is a busy guy. Yeah. And I feel like information overload a little bit. I don't know if you ever get that where you're like, things have hit me, and I've learned too much about Oloval too quickly. I'm just like I kept thinking I was like after hearing them I'm just saying, David, he can say that he does his research. Yeah. I personally did not do mine because I feel like a little aunt. He was the grasshopper. I was out of my leap. Because, dude yeah. I thought it was just a little newspaper article about the backstory of the witches tree. And then he comes out, he's written 13 books and he's working on another one. Yeah, I'm like, dude, like all the links, too. Let's just do everything we can to advertise for him. He deserves it. Go read his books. Get his audio books. I'm planning on picking one up. I want to definitely listen to that at work. I'm literally going to go broke because every single guest we're going to have, if they have anything that they're like doing lee, you bought a T shirt. I have a T shirt coming. I actually just talked to him today about the T shirt. It's on its way. Lee actually finished his bigfoot stuffed animal. Oh, yeah, that's right. On his Etsy website, which is Woods Walker products. Anybody can find that. We have all the links on the previous podcast episode and we'll have them up on the website and all that. But I saw a picture of Bigfoot that he made. He handmade them for one thing. So ladies and gentlemen, if you're listening, go buy a Bigfoot. Come on. Part of you, you're sitting there and you're like, I kind of do believe in Bigfoot support. Bigfoot support. Lee, help him get out there and go into the scary places that we're afraid to go to look for that. I'm going to download David's audiobook. I'm going to do it because I'm hooked on audiobook. And this is fascinating. Just crazy about me and anybody that wants to go and do the research on Old Louisville. I just did a crash course with David. This man knows his stuff and you're not going to be disappointed. I'm sorry I took you on this ride and I totally did not give you any. I'm fully enjoying this, but I'm just really glad that David as big of an author he is. I'm glad that he jumped on this unknown podcast, willing to spread the word. Right. But yeah, I mean, in all honesty, wow. I'm glad that you got our second guest. Second guest. Third episode. I'm third episode. I'm so excited, guys. I love you all. I love everybody that subscribe and future subscribers. I feel like we're like a little we're like a little baby podcast and we just stood up for like a second. We just stood up a little bit and we're just waiting to be a big boy now. You know what I mean? We're about to take our first steps. So ladies and gentlemen, if you're ever around old Louisville? Old haunted louisville. Walking those streets with ghosts and witches? And all the things that go bump in the night? If you happen upon a strange looking tree? Maybe you could stop and pay attribute to it? Or maybe you should keep on walking. Whatever you do, don't disrespect it? Or the next one that the witches look at might be you.